Andrew, I liked the Kim Kardashian/Marilyn's dress reflection. I like that you pose a question to yourself- "Would I want these material things if I could have them?" More importantly, what would they represent? Truth be said- I must admit, personally I'd like the opportunity to experience if I could say no! This post made me ask a different question, "what it must feel like to be a Kim K. or a Marilyn or someone like them?" At some point, does the need for fame or being recognized in public outweigh the true self or does that become part of the true self? I don't know. But as you pointed out it appears that people who are famous often say they just want to "be alone" to paraphrase Greta Garbo. But for how long do they want this? Just a break for a short time, longer? Because I go back to my question, does being famous become a part of who you are or how you see yourself and the difficulty becomes in knowing the difference. Thanks for inspiring me to respond. Mom would have had fun discussing this one!
Thanks so much for reading and weighing in, Glynis.
Let me take your questions one at a time.
1) Does the need for fame outweigh the true self or become part of the true self?
Perhaps it depends on what you mean by the "true self." I've been influenced by my reading of C.G. Jung, so I believe there's a difference between the ego and the Self. The ego is the part of us that will die when the soul leaves the body. The Self is the part that lives on. It's just using the ego/physical body as a kind of space suit to continue its journey. That's how I see it. Which means that any hankering after fame or attention is, to my way of thinking, just a manifestation of the ego or personality trying to elevate itself, puff itself up, for whatever reason. A desire to feel loved, an effort to compensate for deep-seated feelings of inadequacy or inferiority. Who knows?
I don't think fame become part of the true Self, but perhaps achieving fame or recognition informs the soul and helps it on its own journey toward wholeness or whatever it's seeking. I like thinking that our deepest feelings come mainly from the soul. That the soul's longings make themselves known to us through our feelings. But of course one has to know oneself well enough to distinguish between mere ego-desire and soulful longing.
2) Does being famous become part of who you are or how you see yourself, and is the real difficulty knowing the difference?
I think some people manage to integrate fame into their personalities more easily than others. But even they have to deal with the difference between ego desire and the Self. Almost all ego is a mask of some kind.
Joseph Campbell tells a story about a US Senator who's flying from DC to his home state. On the plane, he sits next to a citizen who relates to him as Senator. He speaks with authority and knowledge and as a representative of government. But he'd better not act like that when he gets home and asks his wife for dinner. (Or something else). Campbell's point is that all these different roles we play are just masks. Once you get to know your Self, it probably become easier to wear and remove these masks at will. That's the trick. And not everybody is up to it.
I agree with you that we'd be talking about this around the dining-room table till the cows came home (if we had cows). And it would be fun!
Your mother would be very proud of the miracle of your writing. The miracle of how you bring her to life through your writing. The gift you give us by constantly bringing her to life. Thank you for this.
Thanks so much. It’s amazing to me how much my mom comes up when I write. I always feel that I’m getting to something essential in myself when she does.
The more I read about your mother, the more I love her, Andrew. She was really something! Nice that you started this piece with an event that made a strong impression on you as a child - it was the perfect intro to your examples of doing the right thing that followed.
She was quite something. No question about it. That memory remains vivid for me after all this time. I'm really glad to know some of the love I feel for her found its way from my description to you. Thanks so much for saying that. And for reading/listening, of course, and sharing this lovely response.
Thanks so much for reading. I remember when you met my mother. We all thought we were so grown up back then, and we still had so much more living to do. I'm glad you remember that she was kind. And you're right, of course. She was quite the role model. Thanks again.
I appreciate what you have had to say in the last couple of posts about the "big lie" and feel truly helpless in the face of that reality. I can believe in the daily miracle and at the same time fear the steam roller effect of the big lie on our world. There just seems to be a tidal wave of them seeking to drown sanity. By the way, Thomas More died in 1535 not 1835.
It's really good to know you have appreciated these last two posts about the "big lie." Thanks so much for taking the time to read them and to share your thoughts here. As soon as I was made aware of that typo, I thought of you immediately, history scholar that you are. I knew you would catch it and nearly contacted you to let you know I've corrected it in the online and recorded versions. Nevertheless, I'm glad you caught it. Thanks again for weighing in on today's post.
Andrew, I liked the Kim Kardashian/Marilyn's dress reflection. I like that you pose a question to yourself- "Would I want these material things if I could have them?" More importantly, what would they represent? Truth be said- I must admit, personally I'd like the opportunity to experience if I could say no! This post made me ask a different question, "what it must feel like to be a Kim K. or a Marilyn or someone like them?" At some point, does the need for fame or being recognized in public outweigh the true self or does that become part of the true self? I don't know. But as you pointed out it appears that people who are famous often say they just want to "be alone" to paraphrase Greta Garbo. But for how long do they want this? Just a break for a short time, longer? Because I go back to my question, does being famous become a part of who you are or how you see yourself and the difficulty becomes in knowing the difference. Thanks for inspiring me to respond. Mom would have had fun discussing this one!
Thanks so much for reading and weighing in, Glynis.
Let me take your questions one at a time.
1) Does the need for fame outweigh the true self or become part of the true self?
Perhaps it depends on what you mean by the "true self." I've been influenced by my reading of C.G. Jung, so I believe there's a difference between the ego and the Self. The ego is the part of us that will die when the soul leaves the body. The Self is the part that lives on. It's just using the ego/physical body as a kind of space suit to continue its journey. That's how I see it. Which means that any hankering after fame or attention is, to my way of thinking, just a manifestation of the ego or personality trying to elevate itself, puff itself up, for whatever reason. A desire to feel loved, an effort to compensate for deep-seated feelings of inadequacy or inferiority. Who knows?
I don't think fame become part of the true Self, but perhaps achieving fame or recognition informs the soul and helps it on its own journey toward wholeness or whatever it's seeking. I like thinking that our deepest feelings come mainly from the soul. That the soul's longings make themselves known to us through our feelings. But of course one has to know oneself well enough to distinguish between mere ego-desire and soulful longing.
2) Does being famous become part of who you are or how you see yourself, and is the real difficulty knowing the difference?
I think some people manage to integrate fame into their personalities more easily than others. But even they have to deal with the difference between ego desire and the Self. Almost all ego is a mask of some kind.
Joseph Campbell tells a story about a US Senator who's flying from DC to his home state. On the plane, he sits next to a citizen who relates to him as Senator. He speaks with authority and knowledge and as a representative of government. But he'd better not act like that when he gets home and asks his wife for dinner. (Or something else). Campbell's point is that all these different roles we play are just masks. Once you get to know your Self, it probably become easier to wear and remove these masks at will. That's the trick. And not everybody is up to it.
I agree with you that we'd be talking about this around the dining-room table till the cows came home (if we had cows). And it would be fun!
Thanks again!
Your mother would be very proud of the miracle of your writing. The miracle of how you bring her to life through your writing. The gift you give us by constantly bringing her to life. Thank you for this.
Thanks so much. It’s amazing to me how much my mom comes up when I write. I always feel that I’m getting to something essential in myself when she does.
The more I read about your mother, the more I love her, Andrew. She was really something! Nice that you started this piece with an event that made a strong impression on you as a child - it was the perfect intro to your examples of doing the right thing that followed.
She was quite something. No question about it. That memory remains vivid for me after all this time. I'm really glad to know some of the love I feel for her found its way from my description to you. Thanks so much for saying that. And for reading/listening, of course, and sharing this lovely response.
Appreciate your perspective.
I once briefly met your mother in her home. My recollection is of a very kind lady. She must’ve been a wonderful role model for you.
Thanks so much for reading. I remember when you met my mother. We all thought we were so grown up back then, and we still had so much more living to do. I'm glad you remember that she was kind. And you're right, of course. She was quite the role model. Thanks again.
Brilliant. I think your correlation is brilliant. Your perspective was enlightening; and much appreciated.
Bravo
Thanks so much for taking the time to read/listen. Glad to know you found something of value in it. Much appreciated.
I appreciate what you have had to say in the last couple of posts about the "big lie" and feel truly helpless in the face of that reality. I can believe in the daily miracle and at the same time fear the steam roller effect of the big lie on our world. There just seems to be a tidal wave of them seeking to drown sanity. By the way, Thomas More died in 1535 not 1835.
It's really good to know you have appreciated these last two posts about the "big lie." Thanks so much for taking the time to read them and to share your thoughts here. As soon as I was made aware of that typo, I thought of you immediately, history scholar that you are. I knew you would catch it and nearly contacted you to let you know I've corrected it in the online and recorded versions. Nevertheless, I'm glad you caught it. Thanks again for weighing in on today's post.